By gisette
Peppers, the Rematch
Submitted on Wed, 2009/03/18 - 10:16pm
Last updated on Sun, 2009/10/11 - 3:40pm
Posted in
2009-03-18: Planted new pepper garden. Starting in Pro100, to swap bowls into my Deluxe sometime. For the moment, have 2 pods of Korean red curl lettuce (to replant my outriders), a bambino eggplant (doing its baby thing before joining the adult-strength-fruiting-nutes with the other bambino eggplant), and a tomato-starting pod sharing the space. And one pepper seed is still MIA, but should arrive tomorrow.
The new pepper lineup is (all from Park Seed) :
1 Sweet banana pepper - sweet Hungarian. (Not on Park website at the moment - was a freebie.)
1 Mariachi pepper - sweet / very mildly hot Mexican chile pepper.
I'm not sure there's room for all three in the Deluxe, but we'll try it. Peppers like peppers for company. 
They all grow around 2' tall.
2009-03-21 : Mariachi pepper seed finally arrived, and new Park Seed "replacement sponges for the 40-cell planting block" (hereafter to be referred to as fat sponges 
). Planted Mariachi pepper in fat sponge.
2009-03-28 : Something's wrong... Mariachi pepper failed, had to cut 2 big diseased leaves off eggplant, tomato seedling looks ill... Pulled all plants from system and did a bleach cleaning cycle (rinsed and sat the pods in chlorinated tap water while this was going on). Replaced the Mariachi pepper with a Park Starts plug I'd been growing in parallel, only a day younger. Nutes 1/2 teaspoon each of Micro/Gro/Bloom, in mostly-distilled + a little tap water. Hopefully this garden back on track...
2009-04-02 : Peppers all on track, ~2 weeks old. Eeking the EC up (1.5 now). Eggplant moved out. Swapped pepper bowl into Deluxe.
2009-04-10 : Got GH Flora Micro (aot Micro Hardwater), and replaced fluids on all Aerogardens with rainwater / new Micro formulations. Plants responded same day. I shouldn't have been using the hardwater formulation with rain / distilled water all this time. (One exception: ornamental mini got tap water and an AG Large tablet. The snapdragon colors were prettier with AG Large.)
2009-04-13: Finally got a General Hydroponics pH control kit and tested all my GH-nute Aerogardens. Oy... Adjusted pH on peppers from ~5 to ~6.5. Apparently the last collection of rainwater had ~6 pH. Usually rain is much closer to 7...
2009-04-19: Top-pruned the carmen and banana peppers. The mariachi is four days younger. The carmen pepper was already developing its side buds, before topping.
2008-05-02: Buds forming, new branches pretty crowded. Started topping off with bloom mix.
2009-05-11: First flower open (carmen).
2009-05-17: First mariachi flowers open (youngest plant).
2009-05-18: First banana flower open (biggest plant - by the window).
2009-05-24: Aphids on banana pepper. 
Sprayed with GardenSafe insecticide. Also used some Tomato Blossom set spray, to see if it would help persuade the peppers to set and mature one. Still dropping blossoms and fruitlets.
Also tried new recipe nutes - 2 / 1.5 / 2.5 tsp micro / grow / bloom, 1.8 EC, just topping off. Sort of a pepper / eggplant compromise.
2009-05-30: Neither peppers nor eggplant seem impressed with new recipe - resume old one. It's really past time for these plants to set some convincing fruit - lights already at max and they've been blooming a while. May need to remove the poorest-performing banana pepper.
2009-05-31: went ahead and replaced 1/2+ of the fluids with new mix (actually 2/1/3 came to only 1.8 EC, and continued up to 2.4 EC by adding only micro and bloom, mix of hardwater and normal micro, in tap water). Removed the banana pepper (they were a Park Seed freebie, and I have another outside). Pruned the other two and trellised, brought lights down a notch.
2009-07-12: Heavy anti-aphid treatment (triazicide & hosing down).
2009-07-18: Removed mariachi pepper - let's try the carmen with all the light to itself...
Harvest total: 16 carmen pepper (first, 8/15 red, 22 weeks). Very small.
2009-10-11: Terminated to make way for a tomato plant.
Wed, 2009/03/18 - 10:35pm
#2
Great minds... Actually, I've been planning this a while, just got held up waiting for the Mariachi seeds and giving the little eggplant a head start.
Thu, 2009/03/19 - 8:01am
#3
Looking forward to these. 
Remember we had trouble with our plants growing too high, up into the lights before frying themselves; and the subsequent cutting down of the plant with many buds lost...
Well, I was having a read through an old book and I came across the art of 'snapping' the branches that grow too tall. I'm not sure if you know about this, but you basically snap the branch at a 90° angle, but don't over snap it. The stem breaks (but not completely) and will heal itself within 2 to 4 days, forming a stiff joint; the branch that you've snapped lays on top of the other branches and continues to grow - you thus keep you fruit and keep the darn thing out of the lights. If the branch is heavy though, you do need to support it or it will break off entirely.
I wish I had read this before, I could have increased my cherry tom yield no end.
Thu, 2009/03/19 - 9:32am
#4
Ooh.. Looking forward to your pepper grow. That's in my plan for fall. Peat- interesting concept. What book did you find this in?
Beth
Thu, 2009/03/19 - 9:47am
#5
Thu, 2009/03/19 - 9:55am
#6
Nice book.
Thu, 2009/03/19 - 10:19am
#7
Definitely an interesting technique, Peat! Shall have to try that if they get into the lights. Which they probably will... But to start out, I think I'm going to do the early pruning I neglected on the last round of peppers, and they'll be in a taller AG this time, and I know what height they're supposed to be. So hopefully these won't be quite as much of a nuisance...
Trying to learn from experience this go-round. 
Fri, 2009/03/20 - 2:20pm
#8
Perfect timing, Peat. I was wondering why none of my green chile plants had dead leaves yet from the top half falling over. That explains it. I've been afraid to mess with them 'til I see some dead branches.
Sat, 2009/04/11 - 12:48pm
#9
3 weeks: Looking good. Got new nutes with flora micro (instead of hardwater) + rain yesterday.
Sat, 2009/04/18 - 8:36pm
#10
4 weeks: Happy plants for the most part, but leaves all curled up. Got a pH test kit, and indeed the pH was very low, so raised it. But leaves still curled. Yesterday I decided to raise the Deluxe hood, though the plants were nowhere near the lamps, just because it was so hot under those lights. They seem to have uncurled a little since then. Need to top-prune them pretty soon, but the tops are too compacted at the moment to find the cutting spot.
Sun, 2009/04/19 - 2:56am
#11
Wow, you're getting your money's worth out of that AG. 
Remember when I first tried using distilled water in the AutoPot's Flora mix and almost paniced when it read 5.3 PH? Distilled water has a PH of 7.0 so maybe you've always had that low a PH level, you think? I never trusted litmus paper.
Sun, 2009/04/19 - 1:03pm
#12
Yeah, really. I've probably always had pH problems with the liquid nutes. And that's likely why I haven't had as clear improvement using them vs using the AG tabs. The AG tabs definitely do a better job buffering the pH to keep it in line.
But even with the pH control kit - the adjusted pH isn't staying stable. It seems to just fall again.
I wonder if the FloraMato/MaxiGro dry line of products has better pH buffers.
Fri, 2009/04/24 - 9:51pm
#13
5 weeks: top-pruned them all this week (the younger mariachi in the middle a couple days later). They're all responding nicely with new branches growing below.
Leaves still furled - maybe once they furl like that, they don't unfurl? I looked up causes... too much rain (no). Too much nutrients (EC 1.6 on grow formula - using lettuce nute mix, basically - so, no.) Excessive pruning... well, the leaf roll preceded the pruning, but perhaps. < shrug > I still think it was too much heat, and reflective-drape-induced confusion. Removed drapes. They're probably OK.
The carmen pepper (like the one in the pot) is on the right, fwiw. I just transplanted out a banana and mariachi (left and center) today. Big difference in size between these and those, started within a few days of each other. They really do grow a lot faster in the AG.
Sat, 2009/04/25 - 4:41am
#14
Aside from the leaf furle, they look in very good health - really green with no sign of damage. I'd be really happy with these. 
Sat, 2009/04/25 - 8:12pm
#15
Thanks, Peat. This is them after a few days to respond to the top-pruning. They do look like they're growing fine.
Sat, 2009/05/23 - 8:03pm
#16
Peppers happily flowering away. Not sure any fruit have actually set - they're dropping flowers and fruit quite a bit. Peppers always seem to do that at first...
One problem, or at least odd thing, though. The banana pepper, on the bottom of some leaves on the sunny side by the window, seems to get a kind of crystal salt looking pale green stuff. It looks a little like aphids, but there's zero movement, no sticky bits on the base. If I rub it off, it makes scratches in the leaves. It's almost like it's sweating out something that crystallizes. Has anyone seen something like that with peppers? Or is this perhaps just a special phase in the lifecycle of aphids. 
I really don't want to do the aphid thing with the peppers again...
Sun, 2009/05/24 - 11:59am
#17
Closeups of the unidentified weird stuff on the banana pepper leaves.
Sat, 2009/05/30 - 3:05pm
#18
Neither peppers nor eggplant seem impressed with new recipe nutes - resume old recipe starting today.... It's really past time for these plants to set some convincing fruit - lights already at max and they've been blooming a while. May need to remove the poorest-performing banana pepper. At least the aphids seem to be under control.
Sun, 2009/05/31 - 4:54am
#19
Have you managed to get any peppers from this plant?
I was just wondering about how you are feeding them, from what I've read peppers don't want much Nitrogen to fruit - it can actually retard the process. The 2/1.5/2.5 tsp ration seems top heavy on the N feed, what about trying the bloom phase recommended by GH (as per my guide) - 8.5ml/4.2ml/12.7ml (micro/grow/bloom) and up the EC to 2.5
Peppers are like tomatoes they want high EC's, if you want one last ditch attempt then give this a go?
I lifted this from another website. Ignore 4 and 9
Flower drop probable causes for peppers :
1. Day temp too high >95F
2. Night temp too low <65F
3. Too much nitrogen fertiliser
4. Too much water
5. Low light levels (reduces fertility).
6. Very low humidity (reduces fertility)
7. Poor air circulation (air circulation contributes to pollination).
8. Lack of pollinating insects.
9. Size of pot
10. Too much mineral in feed water.
Sun, 2009/05/31 - 11:57am
#20
Thanks, Pete. You're right, they didn't like the 2/1.5/2.5 mix, and now they're back to topping off with 2/1/3. They drink a lot, and the experimental mix wasn't all that far off the standard mix, and they only had the experiment for a week. And their behavior has been consistent for maybe 2-3 weeks. So I'm thinking the slight nute shift isn't going to make much difference. I could flush out the water a bit - take out a quart or two and refill. The EC ranges 2.3-2.5.
Humidity is high, temperatures are fine indoors. I've been pollinating by hand, of course, and that's working mostly, but the fruitlets fall off.
I'm thinking I need to remove a plant. They just don't have enough light, with three in there. And despite normal room temps, inside the crowding and under the lights with sun through the window - it could get locally hotter than 85. Dunno about 95... It's a pity, but the pepper in the middle isn't the one I'd remove. The middle guy (mariachi) seems to be the one closest to succeeding, and the window one (banana) struggling worst and cramped by the AG height.
Sun, 2009/05/31 - 2:39pm
#21
Well, for better or worse, I did all of the above.
Went ahead and replaced 1/2+ of the fluids with new mix (actually 2/1/3 came to only 1.8 EC, and continued up to 2.4 EC by adding only micro and bloom, mix of hardwater and normal micro, in tap water). Removed the banana pepper (they were a Park Seed freebie, and I have another outside). Pruned the other two and trellised, brought lights down a notch. We'll see....
Sun, 2009/05/31 - 3:08pm
#22
I hope this works better for you.
Any reason why you didn't dump the whole mixture and start of with a freshly mixed batch, I usually get around EC 2.7 when I mix the quantities I gave you.
Sun, 2009/05/31 - 3:15pm
#23
Not easy to dump, and figure it's less stressful to not replace it all. Close enough.
I used the 2/1/3 tsp standard formula (= 10/5/15 ml) and got 1.8 EC. Then added micro and bloom to reach 2.4.
Sat, 2009/06/06 - 9:13pm
#24
Well... they look happy. Aside from not growing any fruit yet, they look happy. I collected some rainwater this week, maybe tomorrow I'll try that...
Sun, 2009/06/07 - 4:55am
#25
They look happy but do you?
It must be incredibly frustrating to see flowers form and then promptly drop off...
Sun, 2009/06/07 - 2:09pm
#26
Yeah, it's frustrating. But - peppers always do that. 
So - was more frustrating the first time.
However, it's gone on too long now, so I tested the pH and indeed it had drifted down to 4.0 again. Adjusted, and topped with some rainwater. Hopefully they'll get back on track now.
I'm being pretty lax with the indoor gardens at the moment - busy with work (yay!) and getting the outdoor gardens established. So the AG's are getting short shrift. And the new lettuce outriders, I simply decided to dump because I'm not interested just now. The outdoor lettuce is going great, and is so much bigger and crunchier. For now. It'll be too hot in a month.
Sun, 2009/06/07 - 2:33pm
#27
Great news that your busy with work, I can relate to the lack of interest in the AG's sometimes. I still have my other one which has remained empty for months...
I should really plant some lettuce, in readiness for the hot weather and subsequent salad meals. 
Sun, 2009/06/07 - 2:45pm
#28
Yeah, you should, on the lettuce. Will be nice with your tomatoes. But - lack of interest happens.
I've got a mini of romaine halfway to first harvest, so I'm not that motivated atm.
Sat, 2009/06/13 - 8:22pm
#29
Still not getting anywhere with the indoor peppers - no credible fruit. Tonight replaced the reservoir with a new brew of fresh rainwater nutes, pH 6.0, EC 2.5. I do hope they get around to setting fruit, because I think that's about the end of the line can-do wise. If they don't start fruiting soon, I think I should declare them not useful for AG growing, toss 'em, and move the eggplants under the brighter lights. Really did want these... But, the outdoor peppers should do fine for summer.
Tue, 2009/06/16 - 7:39pm
#30
Well, wonder of wonders - a credible carmen pepper has set. (As in, it's getting bigger, though still smaller than a pea.) There are possibles on the mariachi pepper as well, but they haven't grown beyond I-just-haven't-gotten-around-to-dropping-it-yet size.
Peppers seem to respond well to death threats. 
Can't wait to see! We both got into peppers today. How funny is that?!