Sat, 2009/03/14 - 6:53pm
The last few weeks my Flora series mixes have been way off the mark and I'm out of ideas, any thoughts???....
I'm mixing three different Flora mixes - grow, bloom, and aggressive bloom by the gallons. Our tap water hasn't appreciably changed EC or PH but starting a couple weeks ago I had to add more and more nutes to get the right EC numbers. Now I'm using double or more GH nutes to get close to what I had before and I can see a definite darker color change in the mixes so something is not right but what am I missing?.....
- GH replied to an email saying their nutes don't go bad for years and years even though their lid seals are lousy. I bought and used new bottles of micro, gro and bloom with the same results.
- I changed the batteries in my truncheon even tho the original ones test good.
- I did a rough PPM calibration check using the old 1g salt to 500ml distilled water for 2,000 PPM and diluted that 50% to get 1,000 PPM. It's close enough.
- PH is roughly the same as before, using twice the nutes.
So does anybody have any more ideas? I've repeated this half a dozen times and get the same results and I'm at wit's end.
Sat, 2009/03/14 - 8:33pm
#2
That's right for veg mix but why would it go UP diluting it? Sunspots? Aliens? Sounds like you're having a similar problem to what I'm having. I have maybe half a gallon of distilled water, I'll give it a try and get back. Great idea, wish I'd have thunk it, our water is so nice I forget about replacing it with distilled.
Sat, 2009/03/14 - 9:30pm
#3
Just tried a half gallon of distilled bloom mix. I expected ~2.4 EC and 5.3 PH. It came out 1.4 EC and 4.8 PH. What the heck is going on?
Sat, 2009/03/14 - 9:48pm
#4
Beats me!
Sun, 2009/03/15 - 3:20pm
#5
No clue, either. Have you cleaned the ec meter? It recommends soft scrub. Did you let the solution set for awhile? My ec changes a little after a half hour or so. Are the readings repeatable (ec meter on the fritz?)? I can't believe the nutes would go bad like that.
Beth
Sun, 2009/03/15 - 5:54pm
#6
Thanks for the reply Beth. Yep, I clean the truncheon every few weeks, cleaned it twice yesterday and spent over an hour with it in one batch, trying to think it out.. I got the same readings just now as I did yesterday so it's repeatable but......
I may be onto something.... both the "old" and the "new" Flora Bloom bottles are from the exact same batch and I started using a new bottle about the time this started happening. It seems far fetched GH could have screwed up a batch but I'll get a different batch bottle tomorrow and see if that makes a difference. That's the only thing that didn't change during all my troubleshooting and I just noticed it.
BTW, on GH nute bottles is a small white paper sticker, the first four digits are week and year of mfg (0708 is the 7th week of 2008), the rest are the actual batch number. My old bottles of micro and gro are from the end of '06 and beginning of '07, GH said that's no problem.
Mon, 2009/03/16 - 4:11pm
#7
It was a weak batch of Flora Bloom but the new is still not quite up to what I had before. The story doesn't end there, the store's quart bottle measured even weaker than mine but they changed out both bottles anyway. That means there must be a huge variance in GH's mixes. Well, Bloom at least. I would have expected lots tighter QC on their part. A phone call to GH is in order.
And I found the date codes are only right for quart bottles, the gallon jugs batch codes are totally different.
Mon, 2009/03/16 - 4:23pm
#8
I suspect my nutes weaken over time due to rinsing the syringe between bottles.
Mon, 2009/03/16 - 5:40pm
#9
That seems a little far fetched, gisette. The times I used single syringes for all three I rinsed it well, dried the outside and had the bulb mashed or the plunger fully depressed before I stuck it in the next bottle so can't see a way to contaminate or dilute. I got so anal at the beginning I bought three three 1ml eyedroppers and three 10ml syringes but now that I'm mixing so much I just use measuring spoons and tweak if needed.
Just got off a ten minute phone call with GH. Jennifer said they have samples of all their mixes going back to the very beginning and have an independent lab verify each batch. She said she'd have their lab people look into it and get back to me and the big hydro store. It's been an interesting monday, the little store down the street only had one Flora bottle and it was Micro, the next closest one is out of business so I had to drive across town to the big hydro store.
Oh, and I found out how their date/batch codes really work, the hydro store guy was wrong.... the first 3 digits are the employee #, next digit is year and last 3 are the day of the year.
Mon, 2009/03/16 - 6:18pm
#10
Oh, I didn't mean to suggest you diluted your nutes that way. I just meant I do. 
Mon, 2009/03/16 - 8:47pm
#11
Well, you just clean up your act sister, bygum. We're professionals here. Sorta.
Mon, 2009/03/16 - 8:49pm
#12
Yes, but I'm a software professional, and it's a wetware problem. 
Mon, 2009/03/16 - 8:55pm
#13
Have you tried Depends? 
Mon, 2009/03/16 - 8:58pm
#14
Wetware's on the other end, old man. 
Tue, 2009/03/17 - 7:09am
#15
Jeez, sounds like it's time for Depends Overalls li'l sis and they ain't cheap. One little thhhpp and they're toast. Damp toast but toasted nonetheless. Once tried to flush a pair and had the Loo backed up for a week. Is scotchguard still available? It'd defeat the purpose but you'd have a dry pair with little drops dripping out on your shoes. Then there's the trenchcoat to cover them up when you go out in public........
Tue, 2009/06/02 - 7:51pm
#16
peat what scale are u using for ec 500 or 700ppm i have a tester that reads in ppm when i mix nutes i get 1590-1640ppm
Wed, 2009/06/03 - 8:17am
#17
Hello solo008 and welcome. 
The different scales can be confusing, I've got a little guide which may help you to determine what's what - have a read here.
I wish they would get rid of PPM and switch to EC only, EC is straightforward and easily understood. You meter is using PPM, it could be using either the x500 scale OR x700 scale - do you know which one?
In Part 2, Page 6 of the guide is a chart which will convert between all the scales, if you know what your meter is then you can work the EC out from that.
Hope this helps.
Wed, 2009/06/03 - 8:31am
#18
Check the manufacturer's webpage or contact them, they should have the information.
Wed, 2009/06/03 - 9:29am
#19
i have a HM DIGITAL TDS-3 have looked at papers but have not called ill see if i can find a number
Wed, 2009/06/03 - 9:32am
#20
Peat i found your guide a week ago and thats why i switched from the tablets. I havent killed my peppers yet but it has only been one day from the switch.
Do you have any more of that distilled water? I'm thinking something in the tap water must be reacting with something in the nutes.
I had a weird one last night. Mixed a bunch of standard veg mix (3-2-1 tsp per gallon) and it came to 1.8 EC. So added a little tap water to weaken it for the lettuces. But - the EC went up. I just gave up and used it as it was.